From ProChoice Atheist to Pro-Life Christian - Vicky's Testimony

WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.600 --> 00:00:05.799 I Am Yours, I am yours, I am yours, s and me. 2 00:00:06.160 --> 00:00:10.070 Lord, I am welcome to Gospel Center pro life, the podcast where 3 00:00:10.070 --> 00:00:13.310 we talk about pro life issues in light of the Gospel. This episode we're 4 00:00:13.310 --> 00:00:16.469 going to talk with Vicki Cassi Org, who's the volunteer coordinator for cities for 5 00:00:16.589 --> 00:00:19.750 life. She can to share her testimony and how she got involved in the 6 00:00:19.750 --> 00:00:33.380 pro life movement. I felt show passish, touch your heart. Welcome to 7 00:00:33.380 --> 00:00:38.649 the Gospel Center pro life podcast and video. We appreciate all those who are 8 00:00:38.689 --> 00:00:44.090 watching and we'd shared in the previous video about what it means to be Gospel 9 00:00:44.090 --> 00:00:47.289 centered in pro life and kind of the ends and outs that mean. Vicky 10 00:00:47.369 --> 00:00:51.240 talked a little bit about that and right now we're going to talk about kind 11 00:00:51.240 --> 00:00:56.159 of our testimony and I really wanted to ask Vicki about her testimony and how 12 00:00:56.320 --> 00:01:00.359 she got involved in pro life ministry, because want you guys to understand where 13 00:01:00.399 --> 00:01:03.510 we come from. You know, we're people just like you. Have the 14 00:01:03.950 --> 00:01:08.109 struggles that you have and and, by God's grace, hold the convictions that 15 00:01:08.189 --> 00:01:12.310 many of you do, but we all arrive at those convictions at different places 16 00:01:12.469 --> 00:01:15.269 and from different places, and for different reasons, and so we wanted to 17 00:01:15.269 --> 00:01:19.180 share a little bit of our experience to help encourage you guys, and and 18 00:01:19.939 --> 00:01:23.819 so right off bad I'm just going to ask Vicki some questions about her her 19 00:01:23.900 --> 00:01:27.659 role within the pro life movement and then sort of how she got there. 20 00:01:27.739 --> 00:01:32.579 So so how did well, first and foremost, what is your role within 21 00:01:32.620 --> 00:01:36.370 the pro life movement? What's your heart to to do? Kind of what 22 00:01:36.650 --> 00:01:40.370 has God called you to within the prolife movement? Okay, well, first 23 00:01:40.409 --> 00:01:44.170 and foremost, to be a sidewalk counselor to be out on their counseling mom 24 00:01:44.370 --> 00:01:49.400 speaking up for the unborn. I feel that I am God has clearly called 25 00:01:49.439 --> 00:01:55.599 me to do that. Secondly, more a specific role within cities for life 26 00:01:55.879 --> 00:02:00.680 is I'm the volunteer coordinator. So I helped to train the volunteers that are 27 00:02:00.760 --> 00:02:05.230 coming on board through we have a fairly extensive training process and we want to 28 00:02:05.269 --> 00:02:08.710 make sure that they feel enabled. Some of our folks have been doing this, 29 00:02:08.870 --> 00:02:13.909 like you, for a decade and so there's a lot of experience and 30 00:02:14.030 --> 00:02:17.699 you definitely can learn from the experience of others. So so I hope to 31 00:02:17.740 --> 00:02:22.699 train the volunteers, equip them, make sure that they have the materials that 32 00:02:22.819 --> 00:02:24.379 they need to be able to be effective. Make sure our side box are 33 00:02:24.419 --> 00:02:30.530 filled for as well as possible for the hours that that the abortion centers in 34 00:02:30.569 --> 00:02:35.770 Charlotte are open. Yeah, and so just for folks who don't know, 35 00:02:35.969 --> 00:02:39.449 who aren't familiar with what you know kind of what goes on here in Charlotte, 36 00:02:39.449 --> 00:02:44.009 and we speak from that perspective as sidewall counselors here in Charlotte, because 37 00:02:44.050 --> 00:02:47.199 that's where we're at and and that's what we involved in every day, is 38 00:02:47.240 --> 00:02:53.479 sidewall counseling here in Charlotte. There are three actually soon to be, unless 39 00:02:53.919 --> 00:02:59.750 unless something miraculous happens, for abortion centers, and Charlotte is an abortion destination 40 00:02:59.949 --> 00:03:04.150 for a lot of the states here in the southeast and they do it the 41 00:03:04.509 --> 00:03:07.469 the main abortion clinic here in Charlotte somewhere, sometimes as many as fifty or 42 00:03:07.469 --> 00:03:13.219 sixty abortions a day, but on average twenty five to thirty abortions every day, 43 00:03:13.259 --> 00:03:15.580 six days a week. And so it's our heart to have a Christian 44 00:03:15.620 --> 00:03:19.580 presence there on those sidewalks every day the the doors are open, especially at 45 00:03:19.580 --> 00:03:23.219 that main abortion center. And so God, by His grace is raised up 46 00:03:23.219 --> 00:03:27.060 an army of volunteers, but it takes someone to manage that. It takes 47 00:03:27.409 --> 00:03:29.889 training. You don't just can't just throw people out there. I mean you 48 00:03:29.930 --> 00:03:32.009 can, but they won't be as effective as they possibly can be unless you 49 00:03:32.490 --> 00:03:35.849 put some of what you've learned into them. And I'll say, and I'll 50 00:03:35.849 --> 00:03:38.009 say it again, I've said it before, Vicky's probably one of the most 51 00:03:38.009 --> 00:03:43.520 skilled sidewalk counselors that I've ever met and it's very effective. And one of 52 00:03:43.520 --> 00:03:49.159 the things that we've discovered in training up volunteers and equipping volunteers is look at 53 00:03:49.280 --> 00:03:51.520 look at how we do it. By God's grace, we've learned a lot 54 00:03:51.560 --> 00:03:55.310 of stuff and kind of shadow what we're doing here and of course we're always 55 00:03:55.310 --> 00:03:59.430 open to learn stuff ourselves, but we feel like the Lord is given us 56 00:03:59.430 --> 00:04:01.830 a real good model for training and for implementing that training on the sidewalk. 57 00:04:01.870 --> 00:04:05.550 And so people come and shadow Vicky and and we had this point. How 58 00:04:05.590 --> 00:04:09.669 many volunteers do we have within cities for life? And we've got, you 59 00:04:09.750 --> 00:04:13.500 know it, a hundred, probably, if not more. Actively on the 60 00:04:13.659 --> 00:04:19.300 sidewalk at least, probably fifty. But but I wanted to add something to 61 00:04:19.339 --> 00:04:25.889 you, to what we've already talked about a little bit, in that the 62 00:04:26.689 --> 00:04:30.889 God has called me to speak truth and and to speak it in love and 63 00:04:30.250 --> 00:04:35.649 so and I think that's that's part of being a gospel focused ministry, Pro 64 00:04:35.850 --> 00:04:43.040 Life Ministry, is we are called upon to peak speak truth. But as 65 00:04:43.120 --> 00:04:48.480 you kind of look through what how Jesus interacted with with those who were in 66 00:04:48.720 --> 00:04:55.670 sin, it's it's with truth and not with name calling or really very little 67 00:04:55.670 --> 00:05:00.350 anger. sear it's anger against the hypocrisy of the Pharisees. But but he 68 00:05:00.990 --> 00:05:06.540 has, he unabashedly shared the truth of God's word, but he always spoke 69 00:05:06.660 --> 00:05:14.300 with gentleness and love and and that's really a big part of why what I'm 70 00:05:14.420 --> 00:05:18.300 called to do, I'm very attracted to that that as a pro life model. 71 00:05:18.339 --> 00:05:23.329 Yeah, I want people to come and interact with us and I I 72 00:05:23.529 --> 00:05:28.449 pray that their hearts are changed. I think it was you who said that 73 00:05:28.689 --> 00:05:33.170 if you can talk someone out of abortion, they can be talked back into 74 00:05:33.209 --> 00:05:36.639 abortion. So what we're doing, and my heart is that I'm not trying 75 00:05:36.680 --> 00:05:40.920 to talk anyone out of abortion. I'm trying to share the truth of WHO 76 00:05:40.920 --> 00:05:43.879 Christ is and that their heart will be, yeah, formed through that. 77 00:05:44.000 --> 00:05:46.519 Yeah, I remember one time you told me just a couple of it was 78 00:05:46.600 --> 00:05:51.110 probably maybe six months or a year ago, where you really had just come 79 00:05:51.230 --> 00:05:56.750 to the place where you your heart was not even or not even not just 80 00:05:57.149 --> 00:05:59.910 to go out and say babies, but it was like I feel called to 81 00:06:00.029 --> 00:06:02.629 come out here and share the Gospel. Yeah, like just to proclaim the 82 00:06:02.670 --> 00:06:06.699 gospel of these MOMS. It's an overwhelming and it was not something I ever 83 00:06:06.980 --> 00:06:14.579 recognized or realized was a gift or a calling prior to becoming a pro life 84 00:06:14.699 --> 00:06:21.170 counselor when I realized abortion will never change unless people's hearts are changed. And 85 00:06:23.250 --> 00:06:30.209 these people coming to an abortion center all need Jesus. Yeah, and and 86 00:06:30.410 --> 00:06:34.639 that is the answer to not only abortion but really to every question. Yeah, 87 00:06:34.839 --> 00:06:40.439 yeah, absolutely. The problem is sin, as we talked about last 88 00:06:40.519 --> 00:06:45.279 time, in the remedy is the gospel of Jesus Christ. So just want 89 00:06:45.279 --> 00:06:47.589 to ask you you based on your life experiences. You know, we have 90 00:06:47.750 --> 00:06:51.069 experiences in our past and we come to certain conclusions and we end up in 91 00:06:51.149 --> 00:06:56.350 certain places in our lives, and God uses our past to really shape our 92 00:06:56.470 --> 00:06:59.829 future and to call us in certain ministries and to give us a burden for 93 00:06:59.990 --> 00:07:03.220 certain ministries and that sort of thing. So have you always been prolife? 94 00:07:03.339 --> 00:07:06.699 Is that always been your stance as far as the issue of abortion? Yeah, 95 00:07:06.779 --> 00:07:12.980 no, not at all. I was raised by parents, great parents, 96 00:07:13.139 --> 00:07:19.050 but they they were not spiritual and they didn't believe in God and and 97 00:07:20.810 --> 00:07:26.649 they were. My Dad was very conservative, my mom much more liberal. 98 00:07:27.370 --> 00:07:32.240 But I was raised during the time that Rov Wade was legalized and and society 99 00:07:33.000 --> 00:07:39.399 said this was okay, that abortion was okay. The books that I read 100 00:07:39.519 --> 00:07:42.800 in school, I remember one, I think I talked with you about that, 101 00:07:42.920 --> 00:07:46.110 I thought cider house rules by John Irving, which is as actually a 102 00:07:46.189 --> 00:07:53.029 very sympathetic look at an abortionist and at the the terrible so legal abortions. 103 00:07:53.110 --> 00:07:57.470 That legal exactly. And so it was. It was really kind of trying 104 00:07:57.509 --> 00:08:01.620 to make the case for why abortion should be legal, because these women that 105 00:08:01.819 --> 00:08:07.540 the illegal abortionists saw, we're women and terrible circumstances and he truly believed he 106 00:08:07.740 --> 00:08:11.100 was serving mankind, he was doing a good thing. I did too. 107 00:08:11.300 --> 00:08:13.410 I read that book. John Irvin is a great writer, one of my 108 00:08:13.529 --> 00:08:18.610 favorites, and and I really thought, okay, I'm I I agree with 109 00:08:18.810 --> 00:08:22.810 this book. So so I was, you know, a product of the 110 00:08:22.930 --> 00:08:28.319 times, a product of the all the press at the time and still the 111 00:08:28.800 --> 00:08:35.960 the growing liberal press, that that a woman should have control over her body. 112 00:08:35.799 --> 00:08:39.639 The science back then was nothing like I mean the science never changed, 113 00:08:39.720 --> 00:08:46.789 but the tools to look into the womb look at that babies development were much 114 00:08:46.789 --> 00:08:50.629 less advanced back in that time. So when they said it was the baby 115 00:08:50.750 --> 00:08:52.750 was a clump of cells, there wasn't really a whole lot of stuff out 116 00:08:52.750 --> 00:08:58.100 there to disprove that and I didn't bother, yeah, to discover anything else 117 00:08:58.580 --> 00:09:05.539 here. In that time when Rovyway long the time that Rov Wade was was 118 00:09:05.379 --> 00:09:09.169 handed down as a court decision, and even before that time, do you 119 00:09:09.330 --> 00:09:16.970 remember the debate, the the pro life pro choice debate? You remember that, 120 00:09:16.169 --> 00:09:18.850 like in the you know, as far as in the media? was 121 00:09:18.929 --> 00:09:22.570 there a lot of talk of that? You Remember? You know? Honestly, 122 00:09:22.769 --> 00:09:26.600 I do not. I'm but have a terrible memory there. But I'm 123 00:09:26.600 --> 00:09:31.080 sure there was. But I wasn't at all political. I didn't I read 124 00:09:31.159 --> 00:09:35.360 the comics. I don't think I read a lot of the newspaper, but 125 00:09:35.440 --> 00:09:41.669 I was an avid novel reader and that's why, which is actually fast forward 126 00:09:41.710 --> 00:09:46.710 to what I do now. I think that set the tone for I became 127 00:09:46.710 --> 00:09:50.350 a writer and all there. And I think part of that is because the 128 00:09:50.549 --> 00:09:56.700 novels that I was reading at that time were more pro choice. Yeah, 129 00:09:56.779 --> 00:10:03.179 and socalled pro choice. That John irvy novel really was and and that really 130 00:10:03.460 --> 00:10:09.809 influenced me. If someone pointed one put something in particular that swayed me to 131 00:10:09.889 --> 00:10:13.850 believe abortion was okay, it was that novel. So I thought that's something 132 00:10:13.889 --> 00:10:18.289 that Christians, I think pro life, should pay attention to. We should 133 00:10:18.289 --> 00:10:24.559 not seed the culture to the liberal, demonic evil agenda. Yeah, we 134 00:10:24.840 --> 00:10:28.840 need to be seizing the arts back, and I'm an artist also, so 135 00:10:31.360 --> 00:10:35.279 that's that was very near and dear to my heart. And when I started 136 00:10:35.360 --> 00:10:39.350 writing I was determined that my books would always have God at the core and 137 00:10:39.509 --> 00:10:41.990 a pro life message. And Yeah, or yeah, so when you were 138 00:10:43.070 --> 00:10:48.070 younger with Tom how were you and pro life are when? Well, in 139 00:10:48.269 --> 00:10:54.500 seventy three movie way have been seventeen. Okay, seventeen, so you're been 140 00:10:54.539 --> 00:11:00.500 coming adult. I was right at the age where where that was intended to 141 00:11:00.700 --> 00:11:05.049 reach. Yeah, so do you do you recall was interested in this? 142 00:11:05.690 --> 00:11:13.330 You recall in school having conversations people talking about abortion, talking about the issue 143 00:11:13.330 --> 00:11:16.490 of abortion. You call any conversations like they mean you were in you're in 144 00:11:16.649 --> 00:11:20.480 New York and everybody were Catholics, pretty much right. I mean, yeah, 145 00:11:20.480 --> 00:11:24.600 a lot of Catholics, a lot of lack of religion and honestly, 146 00:11:24.639 --> 00:11:28.600 I think there was a lot of cultural religion maybe, but nothing like the 147 00:11:28.720 --> 00:11:35.509 south. So, honestly, I don't remember. I don't remember discussions that. 148 00:11:35.590 --> 00:11:39.950 That doesn't mean that they didn't happen, but I remember just being very 149 00:11:41.029 --> 00:11:46.350 consumed with being a teenager. Yeah, and the struggles of being a teenager. 150 00:11:46.620 --> 00:11:48.940 And, like I said, that one book, though, which I 151 00:11:50.220 --> 00:11:54.740 can't remember if it was an assigned re eating in one of my classes, 152 00:11:54.779 --> 00:12:01.059 it might have been, and that one book was my discussion that I recall. 153 00:12:01.379 --> 00:12:05.850 Okay, abortion, yeah, and so in your school, even you 154 00:12:05.889 --> 00:12:11.009 know, if there were women that had abortions in your high school, probably 155 00:12:11.009 --> 00:12:13.529 wouldn't have been talked about when the been a I don't remember. No, 156 00:12:15.090 --> 00:12:22.159 I don't remember a single discussion or any woman in my experience at all that 157 00:12:22.279 --> 00:12:26.039 I knew of. Yeah, had it that had had an abortion. Yeah, 158 00:12:26.240 --> 00:12:31.029 okay. And so up and coming, you know, coming into adulthood 159 00:12:31.070 --> 00:12:35.190 and and you know, having read the Cider House Rules Book and that being 160 00:12:35.230 --> 00:12:39.750 an influence to you, and your parents really never talked a whole lot about 161 00:12:39.789 --> 00:12:45.379 about abortions. So it wasn't like a huge topic or anything like that. 162 00:12:46.179 --> 00:12:50.100 So it was always maybe like a default position, like, you know, 163 00:12:50.340 --> 00:12:52.220 pro choice. You know exactly, and know exactly. I was liberal, 164 00:12:52.539 --> 00:12:56.100 not like abortion is. That is a great thing, but it's you know, 165 00:12:56.179 --> 00:12:58.500 if you need a big deal, yeah, it wasn't a big deal. 166 00:12:58.570 --> 00:13:01.929 It was a clump of cells. I do remember that, thinking it 167 00:13:01.210 --> 00:13:05.409 was not a big deal. Yeah, and and so you know, and 168 00:13:05.450 --> 00:13:07.730 you'll probably be asking questions later on, but I'll just get into that. 169 00:13:07.809 --> 00:13:13.360 So when I was, you know, a very young adult with a pregnant 170 00:13:13.360 --> 00:13:16.960 sun planned pregnancy, didn't want did what I was not. I had big 171 00:13:16.159 --> 00:13:20.480 plans. One of the plans was I wanted to ride my bike across the 172 00:13:20.600 --> 00:13:22.240 country. But yeah, and I knew I could not do that with a 173 00:13:22.360 --> 00:13:28.629 baby. And so I and I was deathly ill. I had terrible morning 174 00:13:28.789 --> 00:13:33.190 sickness and I didn't want that baby and and I honestly, to tell you 175 00:13:33.230 --> 00:13:35.789 the truth, I don't think I thought twice. I didn't know the Lord 176 00:13:35.789 --> 00:13:41.259 as not a believer. It had never I don't recall anyone ever saying there 177 00:13:41.340 --> 00:13:46.179 was anything wrong with abortion. Yeah, they may have, and maybe I've 178 00:13:46.179 --> 00:13:50.740 blocked it, but I don't remember it. And it you know, I 179 00:13:50.779 --> 00:13:52.100 didn't want the baby. It's clump of cells. Anyway, it's making me 180 00:13:52.299 --> 00:13:58.129 really, really sick. So I had an abortion really without a moment thought 181 00:13:58.409 --> 00:14:05.529 yeah. And then following that, however, there was I didn't know the 182 00:14:05.649 --> 00:14:11.519 Lord for another decade, but during that that decade, I would have nightmares 183 00:14:11.759 --> 00:14:15.200 of ripping a puppy apart with my bare hands. And I was an animal 184 00:14:15.320 --> 00:14:18.320 lover. Funny, I was an animal lover that would never even step on 185 00:14:18.399 --> 00:14:22.360 an aunt. Yeah, yet I didn't equate what I did to my own 186 00:14:22.399 --> 00:14:28.669 child as as wrong. So, and I think that that shows two things, 187 00:14:28.750 --> 00:14:33.230 the deception of the abortion movement and how it deceives women through the lies. 188 00:14:33.350 --> 00:14:35.789 It's why it's not a clump of cells, it's a living human being. 189 00:14:37.830 --> 00:14:41.019 But the deception of a heart that hasn't yielded. Yeah, Lord. 190 00:14:41.059 --> 00:14:46.740 So, Kenny, you kind of came from at least a nonreligious background. 191 00:14:46.740 --> 00:14:52.860 Your parents weren't religious and coming through high school, you kind of came to 192 00:14:52.929 --> 00:14:56.529 your own conclusions about the issue of abortion, right, at least you know 193 00:14:56.649 --> 00:14:58.529 from reading that that book. And then you've come you came to a place 194 00:14:58.570 --> 00:15:03.730 where you actually had an unplanned pregnancy, unplanned according to you, but of 195 00:15:03.850 --> 00:15:07.480 course we know the Lord's plans are not always our plans. Yeah, and 196 00:15:07.559 --> 00:15:11.720 yet in the midst of that, you chose to have an abortion. So 197 00:15:11.720 --> 00:15:18.840 you're at this point kind of yielding to the culture, what we would call 198 00:15:18.919 --> 00:15:22.710 the culture of death, right to maintain your life the way that you thought 199 00:15:22.710 --> 00:15:28.909 it should be. That's absolutely what happened. Yeah, what were the so 200 00:15:28.110 --> 00:15:33.470 that the decade or so after that, you said you weren't a believer yet 201 00:15:33.190 --> 00:15:37.019 and you were kind of continuing on the trajectory and maybe you had planned for 202 00:15:37.100 --> 00:15:41.500 yourself, and but still with some regrets, or at least you know, 203 00:15:41.620 --> 00:15:48.299 maybe subconscious, sub reconsious regret. I cannot say that in that decade I 204 00:15:48.460 --> 00:15:52.330 regretted the abortion. My immediate response was just what the literature says, and 205 00:15:52.450 --> 00:15:56.889 which is one of the things that we need to know and guard against, 206 00:15:56.210 --> 00:16:00.610 because the pro choice socalled pro choice movement, will always throw this at us, 207 00:16:00.769 --> 00:16:06.200 that women don't regret the abortion and that statistics show, in fact, 208 00:16:06.399 --> 00:16:11.120 that they experience relief. Well, that's true. Based on my experience, 209 00:16:11.240 --> 00:16:14.960 my first response was relief. I wasn't throwing up anymore, first of all. 210 00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:18.950 Yeah, and and now I could go and bike across the country and 211 00:16:18.110 --> 00:16:22.269 I didn't have to worry about, you know, diapers, carrying diapers on 212 00:16:22.350 --> 00:16:26.870 my bike. So that is true, but that's the immediate response. At 213 00:16:26.950 --> 00:16:32.110 most of the pro life study, pro socalled pro choice studies that follow women 214 00:16:32.190 --> 00:16:36.220 following an abortion are not long term studies. There within the first five years 215 00:16:36.700 --> 00:16:41.460 I didn't recognize the severity of what I had didn't done. In those first 216 00:16:41.460 --> 00:16:45.539 five years I I was experiencing all kinds of terrible symptoms, bouts of crying, 217 00:16:45.620 --> 00:16:55.049 depression, desire to kill myself, physical problems and certainly emotional and definitely 218 00:16:55.049 --> 00:16:59.769 spiritual, but I had no idea it was connected to the abortion. Not 219 00:16:59.970 --> 00:17:06.039 till ten years later when I had a planned pregnancy my firstborn son, and 220 00:17:06.839 --> 00:17:14.839 and when, when he arrived and was born, my world changed. Yeah, 221 00:17:14.880 --> 00:17:22.069 I looked at that perfectly formed, incredible miracle of life and and was 222 00:17:22.549 --> 00:17:27.470 like, what did I do? Because I think that's when it first really 223 00:17:27.670 --> 00:17:36.579 struck me I killed something like this miracle that I can't begin to explain how 224 00:17:36.579 --> 00:17:42.099 much loved him. So I was reading the Bible, not to really get 225 00:17:42.140 --> 00:17:45.890 to know God, but because I was a writer and Auth I had always 226 00:17:45.930 --> 00:17:51.009 loved writing from them from very young age and and was always taught that the 227 00:17:51.089 --> 00:17:55.890 best literature without the religious part of it, the best literature ever written, 228 00:17:56.009 --> 00:18:00.519 is the Bible. So I was reading it for the literary knowledge, but 229 00:18:00.240 --> 00:18:04.920 God got his hooks into me and and shortly after honder's my firstborn son was 230 00:18:06.039 --> 00:18:10.720 born, I came to the Lord. Yeah, and the first sin that 231 00:18:10.799 --> 00:18:14.269 I repented of before God was the abortion. That was the first thing that 232 00:18:14.309 --> 00:18:21.589 I recognized was the most grievous of all assault on God. Yeah, so 233 00:18:21.710 --> 00:18:25.950 would you say, would it be correct to say that you were pro life, 234 00:18:25.990 --> 00:18:30.819 or at least headed in that direction before or around the same time that 235 00:18:30.940 --> 00:18:34.940 you became a follower of Jesus? At the moment that I came to know 236 00:18:36.099 --> 00:18:40.660 the Lord, I think that everything changed. Yeah, everything changed for me. 237 00:18:41.609 --> 00:18:44.890 I was not filled with knowledge. I did, I had read the 238 00:18:44.970 --> 00:18:48.609 Bible a lot, but it you know how they talked about how scales are 239 00:18:48.890 --> 00:18:52.369 fall from your eyes as as you grow in the Lord. That's what was 240 00:18:52.410 --> 00:18:56.200 happening with me. The Bible had been I was clueless what it was really 241 00:18:56.240 --> 00:19:00.559 saying until I came to the Lord. And and but was it was immediately 242 00:19:02.240 --> 00:19:04.960 revealed to me that abortion was wrong. So I would say at the moment 243 00:19:06.079 --> 00:19:12.269 of conversion, that was when I realized, how that I was pro life 244 00:19:12.309 --> 00:19:17.869 because God's pro life. Yeah, and and and that from that moment on 245 00:19:18.630 --> 00:19:22.430 I would not call myself an ardently pro life person. I still was not 246 00:19:22.589 --> 00:19:30.380 political, I didn't do anything to to help the pro life movement, but 247 00:19:30.619 --> 00:19:36.339 I knew in my own heart that abortion was terrible, yeah, a terrible 248 00:19:36.460 --> 00:19:38.970 wrong, a terrible sin. Yeah, yeah, I mean I think one 249 00:19:40.009 --> 00:19:45.529 of the things that happens, you know, when we're we're not connected to 250 00:19:45.569 --> 00:19:52.039 the Lord by being saved, we really don't see, you know, what's 251 00:19:52.079 --> 00:19:56.039 wrong, like what's wrong with me? I'm not there's not the wrong. 252 00:19:56.079 --> 00:19:57.680 People are basically good. When we come to know the Lord, we look 253 00:19:57.680 --> 00:20:03.680 back and we see how, wow, I was really a monster. Really, 254 00:20:03.720 --> 00:20:07.470 that is so gracious and how he reveals that, because if he had 255 00:20:07.549 --> 00:20:11.069 revealed the full extent to now what I know about what a monster I was. 256 00:20:11.230 --> 00:20:14.869 Yeah, I think I would have killed myself right then and there. 257 00:20:15.190 --> 00:20:18.509 But he actually I think, I think it's C S Lewis that that, 258 00:20:18.829 --> 00:20:23.019 in one of his novels, describes that our sin is peeled back like the 259 00:20:23.140 --> 00:20:26.859 skin of an onion. Yeah, and he only reveals so much of WHO, 260 00:20:26.900 --> 00:20:30.900 yeah, truly are at a time, because none of us could see, 261 00:20:30.940 --> 00:20:33.819 if we saw ourselves the way God sees, the truth of who we 262 00:20:33.980 --> 00:20:37.650 are. I think at the moment that we come to the Lord, I 263 00:20:37.049 --> 00:20:41.410 do think none of us could bear it. I know I couldn't eat. 264 00:20:41.450 --> 00:20:45.410 There are still even as he's still peeling back the onions, the skin with 265 00:20:45.650 --> 00:20:49.960 me, that I say, really, that was me and I'm horrified. 266 00:20:51.000 --> 00:20:53.759 Yeah. So, so it's a process. Yeah, you know, coming 267 00:20:53.880 --> 00:20:57.240 to the Lord. The first thing he did was say that was sin and 268 00:20:57.440 --> 00:21:04.029 then and then brought me, step by step to where I am. Yeah. 269 00:21:04.549 --> 00:21:11.190 Yeah, so, piggybacking on that statement, where you are now? 270 00:21:11.309 --> 00:21:15.829 Yeah, so you surrendered your life to Jesus when you when your first son, 271 00:21:15.950 --> 00:21:22.380 around the time when you're in your first right son was was born and 272 00:21:23.900 --> 00:21:26.619 you were pro life, or at least you know you agreed with what God's 273 00:21:26.619 --> 00:21:30.380 Word says, you see the value of human beings, that God would send 274 00:21:30.460 --> 00:21:33.250 his own son to die so that we could be rescued, we could be 275 00:21:33.289 --> 00:21:37.730 safe from our sins. So you're sort of like a lot of Christians, 276 00:21:37.369 --> 00:21:42.210 almost like the default position for lost people is pro choice. The default people 277 00:21:42.329 --> 00:21:47.640 position, for Christians maybe, is prolife. But that being the case, 278 00:21:47.880 --> 00:21:51.480 we know that there are a lot of Christians who claim at least pro life 279 00:21:51.559 --> 00:21:56.359 convictions that don't really carry those convictions through to what you would think is a 280 00:21:56.480 --> 00:22:03.910 natural conclusion, like every life should be protected, and I believe that God's 281 00:22:03.950 --> 00:22:07.349 Word is true about life. Therefore, I should go and do what the 282 00:22:07.390 --> 00:22:10.029 Bible says, which is speak for those who can't speak for themselves. So 283 00:22:10.150 --> 00:22:12.470 how did you get there? How did you get from, yeah, kind 284 00:22:12.509 --> 00:22:18.779 of prolife in a nominal way to prolife in a an active way? Yeah, 285 00:22:19.019 --> 00:22:22.660 when I'm coming to an abortion clink, because that's crazy. Yeah, 286 00:22:22.259 --> 00:22:26.099 until you're saying this and I'm going through this whole story in a funny way, 287 00:22:26.180 --> 00:22:29.859 and I never really thought of this before. It was, again, 288 00:22:29.859 --> 00:22:34.450 a book that that brought me to where I am today, or a book 289 00:22:34.490 --> 00:22:38.930 that I wanted to write. So I homeschooled all of my children and and 290 00:22:40.089 --> 00:22:45.359 I was on a homeschool facebook group with Lisa Metsker, who is a second 291 00:22:45.519 --> 00:22:51.920 generation pro life champion. Her family has been in the pro life movement forever 292 00:22:52.079 --> 00:22:56.960 and and Lisa great homeschool or also with a large family, and she would 293 00:22:56.960 --> 00:23:00.750 post on this homeschool facebook group. I became a friend on facebook. I 294 00:23:00.910 --> 00:23:07.069 had never met her facetoface, but she would post about being out on the 295 00:23:07.190 --> 00:23:12.940 sidewalk here at latrobe and and all of these women who were coming for an 296 00:23:12.980 --> 00:23:15.940 abortion who would change their mind, and I was shocked. I thought for 297 00:23:17.059 --> 00:23:19.019 sure she was lying. Yeah, just trying to I just could not believe 298 00:23:19.140 --> 00:23:22.380 that this was happening. And she would talk about being there in the thunder 299 00:23:22.420 --> 00:23:26.329 hurricanes. I mean they were there no matter how wretched the weather was, 300 00:23:26.730 --> 00:23:30.329 and I thought this is a story, this is a I knew nothing about 301 00:23:30.329 --> 00:23:33.529 it. I was clueless. Again, you would think I you know, 302 00:23:33.609 --> 00:23:37.089 I'm not dumb. I don't know why I was so clueless. But so 303 00:23:37.170 --> 00:23:41.599 I contacted Lisa and said could I write your story? I'm an author. 304 00:23:41.799 --> 00:23:45.480 I would like to write a book about Sidebook, a sidebotcount. So there 305 00:23:45.519 --> 00:23:48.880 could I be a fly on your wall and she said absolutely, that would 306 00:23:48.880 --> 00:23:52.000 be wonderful and the best way to do that would be to come to the 307 00:23:52.200 --> 00:23:57.309 training, the cities for life sidewalk training, and then go on the sidewalk 308 00:23:57.430 --> 00:24:03.430 and and see what happens out there. And and I said okay, but 309 00:24:04.109 --> 00:24:10.180 something in me just was terrified. I had not yet spoken of my own 310 00:24:10.180 --> 00:24:14.220 abortion to anyone. No one knew, and you know, that was forty 311 00:24:14.259 --> 00:24:18.380 years ago at that point, thirty five years ago, deep dark secret, 312 00:24:18.500 --> 00:24:22.859 still deep shame over it. I think I did have to fill out a 313 00:24:22.900 --> 00:24:26.690 volunteer form. I vaguely recall, and I think the question on it said 314 00:24:26.809 --> 00:24:33.769 have you ever had a I forget trauma associated with abortion, traumatic experience with 315 00:24:33.849 --> 00:24:37.930 abortion and the way that I was not going to outright lie, but I 316 00:24:37.089 --> 00:24:41.119 was not going to answer it. So I wrote well, I was raised 317 00:24:41.160 --> 00:24:45.640 during the time that rovy way was legalized, was passed, and and so 318 00:24:45.880 --> 00:24:52.549 I believed abortion was valid and a good choice and that's pretty traumatic now looking 319 00:24:52.630 --> 00:24:56.150 back. That's how I hedged the question and fortunately no one out will maybe 320 00:24:56.190 --> 00:25:02.750 not. Fortunately no one ever asked me. So I tried not to come 321 00:25:02.829 --> 00:25:06.109 to the training. I caught it, but ended up coming and sitting right 322 00:25:06.150 --> 00:25:11.619 in front of me was a deaf woman who had it an interpreter. Another 323 00:25:11.660 --> 00:25:15.779 fellow Sidewalk Council Rebecca, was interpreting for her and it was before the class 324 00:25:15.859 --> 00:25:18.779 started. I had told Lisa I'll come to the class but I will not 325 00:25:19.019 --> 00:25:27.049 go in front of the abortion center. And the deaf woman signed and spoke. 326 00:25:27.210 --> 00:25:30.930 She could, she could actually speak very well even though she couldn't hear 327 00:25:30.970 --> 00:25:37.279 a sound. But she she said, how can I be of use because 328 00:25:37.319 --> 00:25:41.839 I can't hear what anyone saying? If I stop a car, if a 329 00:25:41.920 --> 00:25:47.119 woman comes to talk with me, and Rebecca said and signed, but also 330 00:25:47.240 --> 00:25:51.630 said because this woman could read lips. So she said, can you say 331 00:25:52.109 --> 00:25:56.430 please, don't kill your baby? And the deaf woman said yes, and 332 00:25:56.630 --> 00:26:02.710 then Rebecca said, than God will use you. And and I thought here 333 00:26:02.789 --> 00:26:07.299 am I, an able bodied woman who can hear and speak relatively okay, 334 00:26:07.940 --> 00:26:15.380 and and I'm terrified to just even go to the sidewalk to see what happens 335 00:26:17.220 --> 00:26:22.250 again, not even realizing my own self needed healing and that that was where 336 00:26:22.329 --> 00:26:26.730 that fear yes coming out of. So when she said that, I toldly 337 00:26:26.809 --> 00:26:32.170 saw I'll go to the sidewalk and I went and I asked a thousand questions. 338 00:26:32.210 --> 00:26:37.079 I was traumatized, horrified. I could not believe when I saw all 339 00:26:37.200 --> 00:26:45.319 those women streaming into that place. I had no idea and and I saw. 340 00:26:45.359 --> 00:26:47.950 I stayed for I'd in fact, I was the last person to leave 341 00:26:48.269 --> 00:26:55.750 of the group and and pulled away to drive home and just started sobbing and 342 00:26:55.829 --> 00:27:02.339 couldn't stop crying so hard I couldn't see to drive and pulled over, cried 343 00:27:02.500 --> 00:27:04.259 for an hour and then called lease and said, what day do you need 344 00:27:04.380 --> 00:27:07.380 me? It was a Monday. was when they needed me. I'm still 345 00:27:07.460 --> 00:27:15.619 Mondays. It's still my favorite day to be out there and started that following 346 00:27:15.660 --> 00:27:18.849 week. Yeah, turing, I did write the book eventually, not about 347 00:27:18.890 --> 00:27:22.410 Lisa's life but about sidewalk counting and actually my first right, the forward to 348 00:27:22.490 --> 00:27:25.930 that, but didn't the singing in the darkness. Yeah, right, seeing 349 00:27:25.970 --> 00:27:29.410 it singing in the dark word and and you did write then the Ford of 350 00:27:29.490 --> 00:27:33.920 the forward and have and they have since written many, many novels about the 351 00:27:34.039 --> 00:27:40.480 pro life because that's what brought me full circle. Yeah, the Lord and 352 00:27:40.640 --> 00:27:47.549 to a recognition that abortion is one of the pivotal issues of the day in 353 00:27:48.589 --> 00:27:52.670 keeping people away from God and it as an example of the one of the 354 00:27:52.710 --> 00:28:00.500 most severe rebellions against God. Yeah, and so just with a few more 355 00:28:00.579 --> 00:28:07.099 minutes that we have left. How have so the Lord's obviously grown you in 356 00:28:07.220 --> 00:28:11.380 so many ways. Yeah, from, you know, being a young lady 357 00:28:11.420 --> 00:28:17.769 who would yielded to abortion and then ultimately to a mom whose eyes are open 358 00:28:18.130 --> 00:28:21.849 by being a mom and come to the Lord and and then, you know, 359 00:28:21.970 --> 00:28:26.609 walking with God and then coming out to the sidewalk. Since you've started 360 00:28:26.009 --> 00:28:30.279 coming out, you started out as a volunteer on Mondays with cities for life, 361 00:28:30.559 --> 00:28:33.359 five years ago, right and a half. Yeah, and and now 362 00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:38.079 because we just like man, she's awesome and the Lord is using her in 363 00:28:38.160 --> 00:28:41.630 so many awesome ways. It's like man, you know, I told the 364 00:28:42.589 --> 00:28:47.069 the board of cities for life, like man, we should hire this lady, 365 00:28:47.190 --> 00:28:51.069 like we need her to train volunteers, because she can. She can 366 00:28:51.150 --> 00:28:52.990 train volunteers in a way that I just can't, you know, from a 367 00:28:53.069 --> 00:28:59.819 perspective of post aboard of woman, and also just very, very evangelistic. 368 00:28:59.940 --> 00:29:03.019 You just have an evangelist call in so many ways. So how has the 369 00:29:03.099 --> 00:29:07.900 Lord grown you in your walk with him and those five years. And would 370 00:29:07.900 --> 00:29:12.250 you say that you know in those five years of being on the sidewalks that 371 00:29:12.289 --> 00:29:17.490 you've grown in ways that maybe you wouldn't have otherwise in the Lord? Yeah, 372 00:29:17.569 --> 00:29:25.880 there's just absolutely no doubt. I had never, I've never experienced the 373 00:29:26.119 --> 00:29:30.640 closeness to God, the sense of my purpose before God, the scent, 374 00:29:30.839 --> 00:29:33.359 the understanding of a calling. I did not know what that was, I 375 00:29:33.519 --> 00:29:37.710 really didn't. I thought it was a very faithful Christian. For those you 376 00:29:37.829 --> 00:29:41.349 know the past, I've been a Christian now for thirty years and I've only 377 00:29:41.390 --> 00:29:45.269 been out here for five and a half. I think I led maybe two 378 00:29:45.349 --> 00:29:48.309 people to the Lord in those thirty years and in the past five and a 379 00:29:48.349 --> 00:30:00.140 half I don't know how many lots. And and I I recognized that when 380 00:30:00.180 --> 00:30:04.339 when God calls us to do something, he first of all he equips us, 381 00:30:04.380 --> 00:30:07.730 he fully equips us to do whatever he's called us to do. But 382 00:30:07.890 --> 00:30:14.609 there is no greater joy than doing what God has called you to do, 383 00:30:15.130 --> 00:30:19.289 despite the fact that there is significant persecution. Yeah, on the sidewalk, 384 00:30:19.329 --> 00:30:26.079 sidewalk counselor's face some pretty big struggles. My whole world fell apart the year 385 00:30:26.160 --> 00:30:30.319 that I started sidewalk counseling and I think that is important that anyone considering that 386 00:30:30.559 --> 00:30:36.309 would know Satan attacks, he hates, he hates the family and abortion is 387 00:30:36.430 --> 00:30:41.029 his his grown jewel. He you know, it destroys so many women, 388 00:30:41.230 --> 00:30:45.670 obviously, so many babies, so many families. So when, in the 389 00:30:45.990 --> 00:30:51.700 midst of all that persecution and all the attacks in every area of my life, 390 00:30:51.740 --> 00:30:55.900 including my health, I was diagnosed with bring a bring breast cancer, 391 00:30:56.500 --> 00:31:00.980 and and scary time and there were periods of great fear. But I will 392 00:31:02.019 --> 00:31:07.890 tell you there was a piece that surpasses understanding throughout that very difficult year and 393 00:31:08.130 --> 00:31:14.130 my happiest moments are on the side flock, because I knew God is you 394 00:31:14.289 --> 00:31:19.400 seeing me and and there is nothing like watching a life that was going to 395 00:31:19.519 --> 00:31:26.480 be destroyed make a one hundred and eighty turn from destruction and instead turn to 396 00:31:26.559 --> 00:31:30.400 God. Nothing, nothing compares, as you know, nothing. Nothing. 397 00:31:30.519 --> 00:31:33.789 Yeah, here's with that. Yeah, it's you know, I liking it 398 00:31:33.150 --> 00:31:38.269 too, physical exercise. You know, it's a laborious thing to make your 399 00:31:38.309 --> 00:31:44.430 body do things it doesn't want to do. And the fact is, though, 400 00:31:44.509 --> 00:31:47.660 you're not going to your muscles aren't going to grow in ways that they 401 00:31:47.819 --> 00:31:52.339 need to grow unless you use them in ways that you don't normally use them. 402 00:31:52.420 --> 00:31:56.660 The same way. Within our spirit, you know, we have to 403 00:31:56.740 --> 00:32:00.140 push you know, like Paul says, the spirit is willing with the flesh 404 00:32:00.299 --> 00:32:02.849 is weak. Right, our flesh doesn't want to go out and share the 405 00:32:02.930 --> 00:32:06.849 Gospel, doesn't want to make itself uncomfortable, doesn't want to go out to 406 00:32:06.890 --> 00:32:09.730 the sidewalk, doesn't want to speak against things that are evil in our society. 407 00:32:10.369 --> 00:32:13.890 Our spirit does because it wants to do the will of God. So 408 00:32:13.970 --> 00:32:16.920 we have to exercise ourselves and we have to put ourselves out of our comfort 409 00:32:16.920 --> 00:32:21.400 zone. Yeah, and you know, I've I've seen you do that over 410 00:32:21.480 --> 00:32:24.160 the years and just seeing God, God use you in so many powerful ways. 411 00:32:24.640 --> 00:32:29.920 But I know that it's you know from experience it's not us. It's 412 00:32:29.960 --> 00:32:32.869 not us that's doing the stuff, it's the Lord and we're just making ourselves 413 00:32:32.910 --> 00:32:37.269 available, we're just laying our bodies, as the Bible says in Romans Chapter 414 00:32:37.349 --> 00:32:40.630 Twelve, the living sacrifice whole in acceptable to the Lord. We put that 415 00:32:40.710 --> 00:32:45.140 sacrifice on the altar in the Lord, with his holy fire, comes and 416 00:32:45.220 --> 00:32:50.019 consumes that sacrifice and then gives us grace to give a better and more significant 417 00:32:50.059 --> 00:32:53.660 sacrifice. Yeah, but it starts and just those initial steps of faith when 418 00:32:53.700 --> 00:32:58.380 you agree and that submission of your will, and then the Holy Spirit when 419 00:32:58.380 --> 00:33:00.089 I see when I share the Gospel with people and I say and then the 420 00:33:00.170 --> 00:33:06.289 Holy Spirit when you proclaim Jesus is Lord and submit your life to him. 421 00:33:06.930 --> 00:33:12.089 Here's the wonderful thing. The Holy Spirit enters and in dwells you and and 422 00:33:12.329 --> 00:33:15.519 that is something. If I were to name one thing that's changed the most 423 00:33:15.799 --> 00:33:20.200 in me since being on the sidewalk, is that recognition that I am and 424 00:33:20.240 --> 00:33:24.079 dwelt by the Holy Spirit and nothing that happens on that sidebook is me. 425 00:33:24.519 --> 00:33:30.349 Yeah, it's the Holy Spirit using me and it's a privilege and an honor 426 00:33:30.470 --> 00:33:36.509 to be used by him, but it's God working through me and it it's 427 00:33:36.869 --> 00:33:43.460 amazing. Yeah, yeah, I appreciate you sharing and appreciate you know all 428 00:33:43.539 --> 00:33:45.099 that the the Lord, is doing through you and all that the Lord has 429 00:33:45.180 --> 00:33:49.539 done in you, and we want to encourage those who are watching and those 430 00:33:49.579 --> 00:33:52.339 who are listening. We had to just make ourselves available to the Lord and 431 00:33:53.019 --> 00:33:58.849 we present ourselves a sacrifice to the Lord and the Lord will use anyone who 432 00:33:58.849 --> 00:34:00.490 will say, you know what, Lord, here I am, send me. 433 00:34:01.569 --> 00:34:06.809 And we have in this nation a big battle to fight, and all 434 00:34:07.009 --> 00:34:10.039 the battle that we have to fight is not a natural battle. You know, 435 00:34:10.159 --> 00:34:15.760 our enemies are not flesh and blood, like the Bible says, but 436 00:34:15.880 --> 00:34:17.960 principalities, and so there's a spiritual battle that we're to fighting. Christians, 437 00:34:19.000 --> 00:34:23.079 we're called to this battle. We're also equipped to fight this battle and as 438 00:34:23.159 --> 00:34:27.630 in our first podcast, as we talked about, this is not a political 439 00:34:27.710 --> 00:34:30.989 issue, this is not just a Democrat Republican issue or whatever. This is 440 00:34:31.070 --> 00:34:35.590 a spiritual issue. This is a gospel issue. If you're a believer, 441 00:34:35.909 --> 00:34:38.699 God has equipped you by changing your life, first and foremost by the power 442 00:34:38.699 --> 00:34:44.579 of the Holy Spirit through the Gospel, and if you'll just make yourself available, 443 00:34:44.739 --> 00:34:47.420 whatever that means, that sidewalk counseling is at working at a pregnancy center? 444 00:34:49.019 --> 00:34:52.849 Is that with politics, because politics certainly can do some things. Can 445 00:34:52.889 --> 00:34:55.889 God use you in that way maybe to spur some some folks who are not 446 00:34:58.130 --> 00:35:00.610 doing right, and I'm in a political realm, to do right? Whatever 447 00:35:00.690 --> 00:35:02.849 the Lord in your church, you know, God's calling you to to speak 448 00:35:02.889 --> 00:35:06.730 to your pastor, encourage him to talk about the issue of abortion, to 449 00:35:06.769 --> 00:35:10.039 speak to Sunday schools, whatever the Lord's calling you to to protect the lives 450 00:35:10.079 --> 00:35:15.360 of the unborn. He's equipped you by changing your heart through the power of 451 00:35:15.440 --> 00:35:19.320 the Gospel. So step out in faith and we want to continue to encourage 452 00:35:19.320 --> 00:35:22.030 you. So we're going to continue to be putting out podcast and putting out 453 00:35:22.030 --> 00:35:27.670 videos to encourage you guys, and certainly engage with any of the the podcast 454 00:35:27.750 --> 00:35:31.829 or videos. You can send me an email. DPARKS AT CITIES FOR LIFECOM, 455 00:35:31.989 --> 00:35:37.739 cities in the number four and lifecom. You can email Vicky at vcasti 456 00:35:37.780 --> 00:35:43.380 Org. Spell that real quick. A Seo Arg Yep, Vicki Costi Orsa 457 00:35:43.420 --> 00:35:46.460 v cost. You work at cities for Lifecom and we'd love to talk with 458 00:35:46.579 --> 00:35:51.050 you. We'd love to just encourage you. We also have a has one 459 00:35:51.130 --> 00:35:55.170 ministry that's design really to help people nationally who are not local here in Charlotte 460 00:35:55.250 --> 00:35:59.010 but are around the country and even around the world. Want to get involved 461 00:35:59.010 --> 00:36:02.769 with sidewalk counseling. You can go to www dot sidewalks for life. That 462 00:36:02.889 --> 00:36:07.280 sidewalks the number four and lifecom, and that's an equipping website that will help 463 00:36:07.320 --> 00:36:12.400 equip you to get involved on the sidewalks at your local abortion center, and 464 00:36:12.519 --> 00:36:16.119 that's just a resource that we've created for that purpose. So the Lord bless 465 00:36:16.119 --> 00:36:21.150 you, guys, appreciate you watch and appreciate you listening and and be blessed 466 00:36:21.190 --> 00:36:35.500 as you stand for life, for love. Give me our loft for gratitude. 467 00:36:37.579 --> 00:36:46.369 I know it will cost me my love. Nothing's too precious in some 468 00:36:47.289 --> you